In this episode, I am joined by licensed psychotherapist & racism specialist April Harter. She is the founder of the Racism Recovery Center in Colorado. April is a black woman who provides services to white people who want to explore & heal their covert or overt racism. Yes, you read that right. April sees racism as a trauma response and, through healing her own racialized trauma, she's able to hold space for individuals & groups so that a major cause of racial trauma can be identified & healed: racism itself.This is second part of our 2.5 hour interview. If you haven't heard Part 1, do so first. In the second part of our conversation, April talks about the importance around creating intimate relationships with people of color & how easy it is to respond with defense mechanisms that are racist & completely covert.The takeaway? By not bypassing my own feelings around racism, I'm able to hold space for someone else's *experience* of racism without becoming defensive from a place of guilt and overwhelm. This is compassion, trust building, and how we can begin heal trauma between the races.For more information on April's work, visit https://www.racismrecoverycenter.com, or follow her on Instagram @racismrecoverycenter.