On this episode, Jeff interviews Ginger Lapid-Bogda, PhD, an expert in using the Enneagram personality typing system in business. Ginger has trained thousands of professionals worldwide on how to use the Enneagram in their professional work.

Jeff & Ginger discuss how 80% of Fortune 500 companies use personality tests to assess employees and potential candidates. They talk about how this $3 billion dollar industry provides assessment tools that come with both benefits and problems. The benefits include include improved self-awareness, understanding candidates better, shortening the recruitment cycle, reducing bias, spotting dark personality traits, and learning to work better together. The problems include inaccuracies, unintended recruitment bias, and interpretation problems. Ginger focuses us on a specific assessment tool called the Enneagram. Ginger shares how the Enneagram, with its 9 types is inexpensive or free, and can help people not by putting them "in a box," but helping them "get out of the box."