In this episode, Jayson is joined by Kevin Joseph Grogan who is a former Savannah Chatham metropolitan police department homicide detective who has a reputation as a straight shooter, who cares passionately about public safety and the people in the mostly poor minority and dangerous neighborhoods that for twelve years he was sworn to protect. Kevin has traded his badge and gun in for a pen and now is the author of two books. The 2018 book Black Sheep White Cop and the 2022 book Ruffian.We discuss the type of people who go into law enforcement, the price they pay not just physically but mentally and emotionally, the stigma that prevents so many officers from getting the treatment they need and the anxiety and its impact on their performance in the field. We're also going to talk about what we can learn from the past few years to help us find a better way to police and be policed and at a time when so much attention is focused on the criminal justice system, how we might be missing the mark, particularly when it comes to the trauma on both sides of the equation that have left the police and the communities they are supposed to serve unmoored and untethered from this collective sense of meaning.Learn more by visiting our website and follow along with us on Instagram.