I have had migraines so bad that I ended up in the ER, so my interest in this episode was personal. Turns out so much of the country is in chronic pain that it is a major national issue affecting economic considerations like productivity and health care costs and existential considerations like depression and hopelessness. Rachel Zoffness is a pain psychologist who is reframing our understanding of what pain is and therefore how better to treat it. Given the numbers of people who live in pain, I think this might be one of the most important conversations we have shared.

This conversation was had on the set of my PBS show Tell Me More. Special thanks to the wonderful people at Amerihealth Caritas.

Rachel Zoffness’ excellent book can be purchased here.