“It’s not if—it’s how.” That’s how Karen Jones, CMO of Ryder, a supply chain management and logistics company, started wrapping up our interview. It’s also what she tells her team often, and an integral part of how they approach business hurdles. The key to their success, though, isn’t just relishing the opportunity to overcome a challenge—they also rely heavily on a deliberate, test-heavy approach where they have room to explore, experiment, and find bold solutions that work. Another crucial element is the CEO relationship—for Karen to succeed, she noted the need for support from the CEO and board to have leeway in her marketing endeavors. In this episode, we’ll hear more about how she’s formed her marketing mindset through her career, and how learning from failures has helped shaped her current approach. Listen in for a candid conversation about the pitfalls of marketing in a silo, marketing’s limitations within a business, and how effective marketing can accelerate a product’s demise.