The state of our environment just keeps getting scarier and scarier, yet it feels like we have yet to find a way forward. Two Indigenous scholars who run labs to address the climate crisis say bringing an Indigenous understanding to environmental justice could help us get unstuck. A big part of that is seeing pollution through a new lens – one that acknowledges it is as much about racism and colonialism as it is toxic chemicals. Vinita talks to Michelle Murphy, Professor and Canada Research Chair in science and technology studies and leader at the University of Toronto’s Environmental Data Justice Lab. Also joining is Max Liboiron, author of Pollution is Colonialism, and associate professor in geography at Memorial University of Newfoundland.Show notes:https://theconversation.com/why-pollution-is-as-much-about-colonialism-as-chemicals-dont-call-me-resilient-ep-11-170696Transcript:https://theconversation.com/why-pollution-is-as-much-about-colonialism-as-chemicals-dont-call-me-resilient-transcript-ep-11-170697Join The Conversation about this podcast: Use hashtag #DontCallMeResilient and tag us:Twitter: https://twitter.com/ConversationCA  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/theconversationdotcomFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheConversationCanadaLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/theconversationcanada/Sign up for our newsletter: https://theconversation.com/ca/newsletters/Contact us: theculturedesk@theconversation.comPromo at beginning of episode:Telling Our Twisted Histories, CBC Podcasts:https://www.cbc.ca/listen/cbc-podcasts/906-telling-our-twisted-histories