In this episode of the Regenerative Agriculture Podcast, John interviews Joel Salatin, a well-known lecturer and author and the co-owner of Polyface Farms in Swoope, Virginia. Polyface Farms is a “diversified, grass-based, beyond organic, direct marketing farm”. Joel is well-known for his highly engaging public speaking style and is the author of twelve books relating his experience as a self-described ‘lunatic farmer’. In this episode of the podcast, we visit the challenges of mainstream, conventional agriculture through Joel’s paradigm-shifting lens, and learn why farmers are beginning to shift to a regenerative model. Joel also describes how farmers can learn the skills of marketing, communications, and public speaking, and broaches the uncomfortable topic of planning for farm inheritance and succession.  Joel’s worldview, informed by both real-world experience and immersion in a broad range of literature from philosophy, history, and religion, to current events and business, forms the foundation of his farming practices. Joel states that deep soils were not built with 10-10-10 chemical fertilizer, but rather built with real-time solar energy converted to carbon and vegetation that rots or is eaten and manured in place. Joel describes why he does not believe such organizations as McDonald’s or Monsanto are evil, but rather thinks they have misguided beliefs concerning ecological systems and food production. Most often, employees at these organizations truly believe they are helping the world. While their understanding of agricultural processes is wrong, they are not ill-intentioned. The ability to understand the opposition is an important skill Joel developed in high school debate tournaments that helps him to build bridges with those who see agriculture differently than he does.  Joel and John discuss how most farmers desire to better their land and none have the intention to degrade the soil. Yet, many farmers continue to practice mainstream agriculture with its soil-degrading effects. Joel explains that for farmers to change their practices, often they need to face a crisis. He describes how the symbol for “crisis” in Japanese is the same as the symbol for “opportunity”. He sees crises as an opportunity for farmers to move towards more productive, regenerative practices. Joel also describes how we can elicit broader societal change to where regenerative farmers are viewed as the heroes within their communities. The benchmark of success most used in farming is yield. Farmers also consider equipment and infrastructure as benchmarks of success. Joel’s take is that neither of these are a determinant of financial success or farm profitability. He relates an anecdote from his early years when his father, a tax preparer for the neighboring farming operations, mentioned that their own threadbare family farm was more financially stable than those farmers with large and fancy equipment and expensive facilities.  Joel believes the mantra that farmers must feed the world is a fallacy that encourages detrimental practices and unsustainable agriculture. The coronavirus pandemic has sharply defined the need for communities to be able to feed themselves and has placed a spotlight on the drawbacks of the current centralized system. Joel describes his belief in an intelligent creator who has loaned the world to us as an investment. In his words, no investor would accept dead zones, pollution, and species extinction. Thus, it is our responsibility to improve the land and help it become more fertile year after year. Seeing the world as an investment helps people to treat it well rather than deplete its resources for unsustainable growth.  The dysfunction of the current system is evidenced by the statistic that small-scale agriculture produces 70% of the global food supply with 30% of the inputs while the other 30% of the food supply is produced using 70% of the inputs. Joel makes the distinction that the size of a farming operation is not a