Interview with the Magus

By Nathan Dube

Prior to the writing of this book “Interview with the Magus” was a series of interviews I wrote for the now defunct disinfo.com over it’s last two years of existence on the internet. While I had been planning on eventually turning the series into a book, its sudden removal from the web lit a fire under my ass to retrieve the two years of writing I had produced for the website via web.archive.org.

I was relieved to find that I was able to retrieve about 90% of the content I had written and have subsequently published in the book you are now reading.
The original inspiration for the series was twofold. One, I simply wanted to know the answers to certain questions about magic(k) and what better way to get said answers than to ask those who were actively practicing and or studying magic(k)?

I have to admit, I really did not think the series would take off because I was unsure that any of the magicians, occultists, esoteric seekers, psychonauts, psychedelic explorers and deep thinkers that I very much admired would give me the time of day...
I mean, at the time, I was a nobody in the occult scene.
To my great surprise, almost every single one of them were more than happy to give me their time of day!

I attribute this primarily to the fact that while disinfo had really gone downhill prior to Thad McKraken taking over as manager and editor of the site, the name still had pull and for many magicians, it still resonated as a worthy name of esoteric and paranormal journalism. Considering this in the context of a world where there was not the renaissance that Grant Morrison had famously envisioned at the disinfo.con, apparently the disinfo brand still had something to offer.
While the reception of the newly reconfigured disinfo generally had mixed results, I was extremely pleased to find that my “Interview with the Magus” series was one of the most popular new dynamics of the ultimately doomed website. I was so grateful for the opportunity to interview legends of the occult community while also bringing lesser known voices of modern esoteric technologies to the forefront of occulture.

While this book boasts interviews with some of the worlds most renowned living magicians and esoteric practitioners/seekers/scholars such as Mitch Harrowitz, Jason Miller, Jake Stratton-Kent, Ramsey Dukes, Phil Hine, Taylor Ellwood, and a whole plethora of amazing minds and souls, I also point to new shining stars in the occult scene who deserve attention such as Tommie Kelly, Bill Nemo Trumpler, Sara Mastros, Felix Warren, Scarlet Magdalene, Katelan Foisy, Manuel Ignacio Martínez and others who embody the search for spiritual truth and power.

• Language: English
• Publisher: Nathan Dube
• Release date: Sep 25, 2018
• ISBN: 9780463688571

Nathan Dube

I am a musician, artist, digital marketing specialist, and author.

Book preview

Introduction

Prior to the writing of this book Interview with the Magus was a series of interviews I wrote for the now defunct disinfo.com over it’s last two years of existence on the internet. While I had been planning on eventually turning the series into a book, its sudden removal from the web lit a fire under my ass to retrieve the two years of writing I had produced for the website via the web archive.

I was relieved to find that I was able to retrieve about 90% of the content I had written and have subsequently published in the book you are now reading.

The original inspiration for the series was twofold. One, I simply wanted to know the answers to certain questions about magic(k) and what better way to get said answers than to ask those who were actively practicing and or studying magic(k)?

I have to admit, I really did not think the series would take off because I was unsure that any of the magicians, occultists, esoteric seekers, psychonauts, psychedelic explorers and deep thinkers that I very much admired would give me the time of day…

I mean, at the time, I was a nobody in the occult scene.

To my great surprise, almost every single one of them were more than happy to give me their time of day!

I attribute this primarily to the fact that while disinfo had really gone downhill prior to Thad McKraken taking over as manager and editor of the site, the name still had pull and for many magicians, it still resonated as a worthy name of esoteric and paranormal journalism. Considering this in the context of a world where there was not the renaissance that Grant Morrison had famously envisioned at the disinfo.con, apparently the disinfo brand still had something to offer.

While the reception of the newly reconfigured disinfo generally had mixed results, I was extremely pleased to find that my Interview with the Magus series was one of the most popular new dynamics of the ultimately doomed website. I was so grateful for the opportunity to interview legends of the occult community while also bringing lesser known voices of modern esoteric technologies to the forefront of occulture.

While this book boasts interviews with some of the worlds most renowned living magicians and esoteric practitioners/seekers/scholars such as Mitch Harrowitz, Jason Miller, Jake Stratton-Kent, Ramsey Dukes, Phil Hine, Taylor Ellwood, and a whole plethora of amazing minds and souls, I also point to new shining stars in the occult scene who deserve attention such as Tommie Kelly, Bill Nemo Trumpler, Sara Mastros, Felix Warren, Scarlet Magdalene, Katelan Foisy, Manuel Ignacio Martínez and others who embody the search for spiritual truth and power (and who also kick ass).

The second question which this particular tome aims to address is why practice/study magic? To the atheist, it is a fools errand, to the Christian, it is a pact with evil, to the agnostic, it is potentially ritual masturbation… SO, why practice/study magic(k)?

The answer to that question, at least from my perspective, is because…

Magic(k). Fucking. Works…

While the science of magic is far lacking in its cultural race to understanding to that of the art of said craft, I personally believe that magic(k) works because I have done the rituals, charged the sigils, lit the candles and have seen the results.

This is of course where the nay-sayers chant, then why are you not rich! This is the point where I will point out one of the major truths of magic(k)…

IT DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY…

Not right off the bat at least. You see, Magic(k) works for different people for different reasons. Some believe it is psychological, some believe it is spiritual and some believe magic is the process of energy effecting reality and causing the change it claims to make.

The truth is that at certain times, it is one or none of these dynamics and at others it is a combination of said perspectives. Regardless of your personal experience of magic(k), one thing that becomes clear to any magician is that magic accomplishes one goal beyond all others…

Magic done well increases the probabilities of things happening in our favor.

I have personally experimented with many types of magic(k). Goetic petitions, Hoodoo, Candle Magic(k), Chaos Magic(k), Pop Culture Magic(k), High Magic(k), Low Magic(k), etc…

What I have done really does not (or should not) mean shit to you and what you are trying to do with magic. If for some reason you are inspired to practice magic(k) after reading this book, by all means… read for another few years before casting your first spell… Or don’t.

As Jake would say… Burnt fingers are part of the process… And honestly… Magic(k) is not for the weak minded.

Magic(k) after all, is a form of rebellion and power available to those who feel disempowered. At least, this is something I have come to believe from practicing magic(k).

The raw truth is however, magic(k) can and will empower anyone who uses it. Assholes, Kind Souls, Good Folks, Evil War Lords… For everyone willing to do the research and work…

Magic(k). Fucking. Works.

In the end, this book ultimately has one message: you have a phenomenal ability to alter reality and if you focus your mind, spirit and energy, you can potentially accomplish anything through magic(k).

While this book is essentially a collection of interviews, the information provided by those whom I have interviewed therein often time provide extremely practical tips that can be applied directly to your own magical practice.

I wish the best to all readers of this book and hope that you find it inspiring, practical, useful and enjoyable to read.

In closing I shall invoke Grant Morrison invoking King Mob…

Hail Chaos!

********

Nikki Wyrd.

Nikki was conceived at the end of 1967, making it onto the planet just as things began to get really interesting. After spending several years with her head stuck inside thousands of books, she took a few decades to look around at things and people, including herself. Nowadays she constructively criticizes other people’s work, as Editor of Psychedelic Press UK, Director of Breaking Convention, Director of The Psychedelic Museum, and freelance copy editor for a growing list of prestigious clients. She occasionally lectures on occult matters, and has facilitated a number of highly regarded residential retreats. She also runs The Universe Machine, a small publishing house specializing in thought-provoking books. Her best work is yet to come.

In addition to co-authoring the book of baphomet, Nikki contributes regularly to the blog of baphomet. As a practicing magician, psychedelic traveler and psychonaut, she brings decades of experience in occultism to all of her endeavors.

Do enjoy!

Q: What do you consider your greatest magical achievement?

A: The most recent one. I hold successes lightly, and put major changes to the course of expected events aside from further contemplation. I don’t like to dwell over things; that way, megalomaniacal madness lies. I will give you one example of a profound result, which has had the best impact upon my life. I conjured for a nice home when I was expecting my first child. I drew a picture, child style, of a house with four windows, a chimney, and roses in the garden with my cat looking really happy. A few weeks after charging this pictorial sigil, that home was mine.

Q: Who are your personal heroes, those who most inspired you on your own journey?

A: In the field of magical endeavors, Lionel Snell (aka Ramsey Dukes) has to head this list. Charming, kind, approachable, clever and thoughtful, he also rode a very large motorbike wearing shades and black leathers. I remember being at a retreat with him, and one morning finding him in his underwear ironing his trousers; he genuinely has the legs of a god. His talks and books were key to me grasping magic, the art and the science. He leads the audience gently into considering things they would not otherwise give credence to, magic by stealth. And, he is good company.

Outside occultism, my hero is David Attenborough. He, and his enthusiasm, are responsible for my, and many of my peers, fascination with and love of Nature. He also invented the concept of having alternative to mainstream television programs in the 1970s, when he was controller of BBC2. He made a world which opened far more intellectual levels than would have ever been possible without his influence. If TV is your child’s daily entertainment, then having David Attenborough as a private tutor is about the best one can wish for. 

Both of these people exemplify kindly intelligence, applied to teaching beyond the usual confines of their fields with grace and simplicity. These are qualities I admire, and aspire to. Also, twinkly eyes.

Q: What importance, if any, do you place on full visual manifestation of a spirit during evocation?

A: I mostly don’t invest belief in spirits as things we can see. To my mind, that reduces them to ‘normal’ physical things, which (whatever spirits may be!), they are not. My style of magic places more emphasis on spirits as agents of change rather than as physically existing as bodies with mass and the ability to reflect light. Having said that it is common to feel one has seen some kind of distortion of the atmosphere in the place where one has called the spirit to. Personally, I suspect this is more to do with the seer than the seen; if a distinction can be made! I tend towards the view that there is ‘an act of seeing’, which includes both parties within an event.

Q: What was your first oh fuck, this shit is real moment in your personal magical practice?

A: To be honest, I am not sure. It is so long ago. Many of the most striking results sound so ordinary when told. For instance, I conjured a black cab on a deserted street in less than a minute on a dismal walk home from a nightclub in London, which doesn’t sound impressive unless you were there and experienced the ecstatic joy this caused for me and my friend. To this day, every time something works uncannily accurately, I get the same Wow! emotion as if for the first time. I should say that the acts of magic I enjoy and benefit from most are those of enlightenment, self-discovery, which are slower to reveal themselves. By placing right attention upon mind and body, we can effect extraordinary changes.

Q: What is one piece of magical tech you could not live without?

A: Can I cheat and say my own body-mind? No? Okay. I would say casting the magic circle (i.e., turning to face the four compass directions, the below and the above; in whatever order and with whatever imagery and iconography is paradigm of the month). By centering oneself in the world, and orientating oneself, the magician creates her own universe, unique and focussed upon her. This creation has profound consequences for all that follows. To stand at the centre of the world puts one on the spot, literally and metaphorically, and this draws out a response to notice, and act on, changes that need making. Currently I am using a very simple version of a Taino ritual every morning as a meditation.

Q: At what age did you start practicing magic and why?

A: I remember studying in earnest various sorts of divination at age around 8, tasseology in particular, graphology, palmistry, and general scrying from random casts of objects (e.g. beads or twigs). Quite why I did this is hard to know; I studied everything so probably saw it as a continuation of science, rather than a separate ‘woo’ kind of thing. Also, for my whole life in our cabinet I saw the crystal ball which had been handed down from my great-grandmother to each eldest daughter, with the knowledge that one day it would be mine, and I knew that my grandmother had read cards and tea leaves for her friends and neighbors. Seeing into the future was not strange. I read lots of books as a child and teenager, working methodically through different genres in our local library (one year, it was Australian science fiction writers). In my late teens I reached comparative mythology, and read all of Joseph Campbell’s books (reaching magic via The Book of Thoth as my gateway text). From here, chaos magic leapt in front of my nose via several people I was friends with, and I began experimenting with paradigm shifting, waving wands and creating rituals. Magic seemed natural, asking why I did it is like asking why I started to dance.

Q: What is your advice to the young aspiring magician just getting started today?

A: Choose your gods wisely. Look after your body. Enjoy doing something each day.

Q: What are your current magical endeavors?

A: My work these days is to expand the models available to mages by investigating and sharing research on the body-mind’s mechanisms of perceptual cognition. How we see, hear, and otherwise sense things. To apply magic to a process, I like to understand the steps involved. Where are the points we can easily intervene? How do we engineer our set and setting (to borrow from psychedelic language) in order to alter existing patterns? I want to push at the boundaries of who feels comfortable using magical models and techniques, to encourage more cultural exchange. By framing invocation as drama therapy role-play, it becomes attainable to anyone prepared to go through the preparatory processes, without them needing to define themselves as ‘occultists’, a label which still carries certain baggage.

Q: How do you respond to Christian evangelists knocking on your door at dinner time?

A: Maybe once a year, if that, Jehovah’s Witness people come a-calling. I wish I could say something interesting here, but I merely open the door, see who is there, say, oh I am busy, goodbye, and close the door. The only other god-botherers I have encountered on the doorstep were some very smartly dressed Mormons. Whether these two groups can be considered Christian is of course debatable; most ‘normal’ Christians (I’m using membership of the World Council of Churches to delimit this group) feel that their teachings differ so much from accepted liturgy that they are outside that definition. If so, then that means I have never, in my whole life, had Christian evangelists knock on my door. This seems a very odd question to an English person!

Q: What effect and focus do you think magic should have upon politics and world events?

A: Revolutions tend to fail, as they merely change who is in charge at the top of a deeply unfair structure, without fundamentally addressing the inherent inequalities. Politics is the froth of a longer game, which emerges from the ways we all decide on innumerable smaller actions. How we spend our time and money each day, whether we travel to visit other places, who our friends are, how we live. For me, The Great Work of Magick refers to a process providing a means through which magicians can take effective steps to align with greater perspectives on the way their actions reverberate throughout the various planes of existence. For me, success in magical life is a combination of self-actualization and allowing other peoples’ development. As Mandela said: Freedom is indivisible; the chains on any one of my people were the chains on all of them, the chains on all of my people were the chains on me.

********

Phil Hine.

Phil Hine is a man who needs no introduction. One of the founding fathers of Chaos Magic and a legend in his own right, Phil has authored some of the most prolific and time honored works regarding this particular magical path including  Condensed Chaos, The Pseudonomicon and Prime Chaos.

In addition to his published works, Phil writes articles for his blog enfolding.org.

It is my extreme pleasure to present to you the interview with Phil below.

Do enjoy…

Q: What do you consider your greatest magical achievement?

A: That’s really tricky, as it’s not something I really tend to reflect on. I’ve always thought it a bit gauche to talk publicly about one’s magical successes. so I’ll I’m going to leave that one aside.

Q: Who are your personal heroes, those who most inspired you on your own journey?

A: I think Syd Barrett was probably my first hero – getting into early Pink Floyd helped me make the transition from sniffing solvents to doing Mushrooms and Acid – much healthier! I discovered the writings of William S. Burroughs not long afterwards whilst still entertaining mainly self-destructive fantasies about being an outsider and for a long time I was really a Burroughs fanboy – used to have dreams about meeting him – so you can imagine how terrified and exultant I was when I finally did find myself in his presence!

As far as magical influences go, there are probably too numerous to mention, but I think the one author who’s had the most influence on my magical trajectory has been Starhawk, who’s common sense and political activism I found very exciting when I first encountered her work in the ’80s, and which inspired me to get involved in the pagan & ecomagic activist scenes which were kicking off back then. That led me to meeting Rich Westwood, who was a major figure in the revitalization of Paganism in the UK in the ’80s, without whom I wouldn’t have ended up starting up a monthly pagan news ‘zine (with Rodney Orpheus) – and, as a consequence of that, getting into publishing as a career for nearly 20 years.

Q: What importance, if any, do you place on full visual manifestation of a spirit during evocation?

A: None at all. I’ve experienced it of course, when I was into that kind of thing, but I don’t think its that significant. It’s just one of the many instances of weird shit that happens.

Q: What was your first oh fuck, this shit is real moment in your personal magical practice?

A: One of my routes into magic was Psychology – I did a three-year Psychology/Social Science degree, and I think for a while I kind of thought of magic more or less entirely in psychological terms – until stuff started happening that I couldn’t explain. Like waking up one night with this overwhelming sense of a presence in the room, and being unable to move – all of which dissolved after I mentally projected a pentagram into the room. Its spooky stuff like that which jerks you out of your comfort zone which I think is really important.

Q: What is one piece of magical tech you could not live without?

A: There probably isn’t anything I couldn’t live without – except perhaps a deep-seated sense of wonder. If that ever does depart, I won’t be long in following.

Q: At what age did you start practicing magic and why?

A: I didn’t get interested in magic until I was sixteen or seventeen. And that came about when I was sitting in the school library one day idly leafing through a bound copy of Man, Myth and Magic looking for photos of naked witches – when I came across a reproduction of one of Austin Osman Spare’s drawings. I was really into Jung at the time and something about the drawing made sense to me in Jungian terms, and so I started to read books about the occult – which led to me trying stuff out – I think David Conway’s Magic: An Occult Primer was one of the first entirely practical books I got hold of, along with David Edwards’ Dare to Make Magic. Doing the Psychology degree and trying out some Lovecraftian magic put me in a place where I met some actual practitioners and it all sort of snowballed from there.

Q: What is your advice to the young aspiring magician just getting started today?

A: If you’re going to try and reach for the stars, it helps to have your feet planted on the ground and your tongue firmly in your cheek. Also, find what engages you, what turns you on, as it were, and run with that. Read widely, but not too many occult books, and if you have to, try not to take them too seriously.

Q: What are your current magical endeavors?

A: I’ve got a number of writing/research projects on the go at the moment. I’m working on an anthology of what I consider to be my best writing on various subjects over the last 35 years or so, with some autobiographical material for added context. Other than that, I guess I’ll just carry on with my practice, occasionally writing whatever catches my interest.

Q: How do you respond to Christian evangelists knocking on your door at dinner time?

A: I’d politely tell them to go away. But then I’d probably respond the same way if they were evangelical Buddhists or Thelemites.

Q: What effect and focus do you think magic should have upon politics and world events?

A: That’s a strange question. For me, magic and politics are inextricably enmeshed. You live in the world, you’re involved in politics to one degree or another. The personal is political and all that.

********

Billy Brujo.

Billy Brujo is the proprietor of Billy Brujo’s Botanica and host of the popular Youtube show The Black Magick Cooking Show on which, he teaches magick with tact, humor, focus and skill.

From Billy’s website:

"Formerly employed by the L.A.’s most high-end and renown occult shops, the master retired due to his disgust with his employer’s mob-style sales tactics and the overabundance of charlatans in the spiritual business.

However, the master has come out of retirement. Billy Brujo is back, teaching the right teaching, and offering the best custom magical objects available."

Enjoy.

Q: What do you consider your greatest magical achievement?

A: Probably my show, It’s helped a lot of people, its made me a few dollars, and it has echoing weirdness into other people’s lives that bounces back to my own in unexpected ways. Easily the biggest magic machine i’ve ever made.

Q: Who are your personal heroes, those who most inspired you on your own journey?

A: Well, I have a lot of heroes actually, but if we’re talking magick, Crowley really was the first thing I read that seemed like he was actually explaining how its done, i had read other magic books before and always felt they lacked the how. Later after Crowley I ran into Peter Carroll and Austin Spare and the Chaos-current, at which point my teachers became anyone with a good idea.

Q: What importance, if any, do you place on full visual manifestation of a spirit during evocation?

A: I hardly ever do the hardcore spirit summoning that way anymore, however there was a time I insisted on having full vision to my physical eyes in a small shewstone, and STILL even then, most of the vision occurred inside my eyelids and not in the stone, I did see a few things however. More recently I work with my own internal spirits so summoning them isn't a problem because they’re always present.

Q: What was your first oh fuck, this shit is real moment in your personal magical practice?

A: The first in general is sort of a long story, I did a money/health spell and lost all my money and got athletes foot, which implied to me I had somehow done it wrong/offended the god invoked (Ra) so i prayed forgiveness for a long time and eventually had an amazing spiritual vision with Ra that I did not expect. This was pretty convincing. But it was a long process and not as climactic as oh fuck… a more oh fuck spell would be when I wished for money and a house, and the next morning found monopoly money and houses in the gutter (less than 9 hours later).

Q: What is one piece of magical tech you could not live without?

A: Words. Seems like a lot of