In the American conversation, there is a large overlap between class and race. Yet very often, we underplay the role that class plays in the dynamics of our legal system In today’s episode, Hunter chats with Amari Harris, the Equity Diversity and Inclusion Attorney for Virginia Public Defenders to discuss those dynamics and more. He describes his much-needed position within the Virginia public defense system, the broken payment structure for contract attorneys, the ways in which Virginia prosecutors can engage in trial by ambush, and the important of crafting public messaging around public defense to fit the demographics and needs of the communities they serve. Amari bridges the gap between practicing public defenders and their clients—helping them effectively approach each client’s unique life experiences. This episode challenges people to constantly think about how messaging around public defense will most effectively get people across the racial and socioeconmic spectrum to care about public defense reform.   Key Topics and Takeaways:   An overview of the Virginia public defense system & Amari’s role within it. [3:04] Why many cases don’t get an investigation even though they need one. [18:26]  The negative impacts of “trial by ambush.” [21:03] Ways that the rural areas are disadvantaged in Virginia. [24:57] How Amari handles the massive amount of diversity in the state. [30:58] Amari walks you through Virginia indigency standards. [43:55] Hunter and Amari dig deep into class arguments. [46:15] Amari’s goals for a better public defense system of tomorrow in Virginia. [50:01]   Guest:   Amari Harris, Equity Diversity and Inclusion Attorney for Virginia Public Defenders   Resources:   Virginia Defenders   Justice Forward   Gideon’s Promise   2016 ACLU report on Prosecutor Power “Unparalleled Power: Commonwealth’s Attorneys, Voters and Criminal Just Reform in Virginia”. American Civil Liberties Union. June 2016. At Page 1-5.  Memorable Quotes:   “Being a great lawyer is fantastic, but you could be a great lawyer and a bad public defender if you can’t relate to your clients, if you can’t engender yourself to the community in some way, then you’re doing our clients a disservice.” (6:20, Amari)   “If there’s one thing that I know from just looking nationally, when you have a flat fee structure like this, you’re not getting investigation.” (18:09, Hunter)   “Just having someone that thinks a little bit differently than another person in the room makes that other person so much smarter than if they just read about the information.” (32:46, Amari)   “If we think of diversity and inclusion only as representing ethnic and racial things, you’re missing the point.” (34:53, Hunter)   “I think race does dictate a lot of what goes on in the criminal justice system and it’s been historic, but if you lead with that, then you will lose a lot of people.” (42:59, Amari)   “Every public defender who stays in this long enough will work under blue and red administration.  And the idea that you simply have to throw up your hands and go ‘well shucks, wait till the guy who agrees with me comes into office’ is not workable.” (49:30, Hunter)