If throwing money at problems solved them, much of corporate America would look like a rainbow coalition by now. Companies have poured millions into diversity initiatives with the aim of recruiting and retaining more women, minorities and people from underrepresented groups. But a lot of what they’ve done hasn’t worked.

On this week’s Game Plan, Francesca and Rebecca ask whether companies are doing enough—and doing the right things—to diversify their staffs. Ellen Pao, former CEO of Reddit, joins to talk about Project Include, a diversity consultancy she co-founded, and how it is tackling the complex problems that keep many workforces largely male and white in a new (and maybe better?) way.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.