On this episode, I explore the concept of denial; something we know is bad on an individual level. But what happens when denial takes place on an industrial scale? That's literally what my guest on this episode Barbara Freese, explores in her new book Industrial Strength Denial.Barbara is an environmental attorney who explores some high profile cases of where corporations have done things that are harmful. Yet faced with proof that they are hurting people or the planet, they deny evidence, blame the victims, complain of witch hunts, attack their critics’ motives, and otherwise rationalize their harmful activities. Denial campaigns have let corporations continue dangerous practices that cause widespread suffering, death, and environmental destruction. And, as Barbara goes on to explore, the fact that they undermine social trust in science and government, means that corporate denial has made it harder for our democracy to function.During our discussion we explore some fo the stories Barbara has researched and written about and look at some of the underlying dynamics; what drives these organisations to denial and what can we do to solve the problem?You can find out more about Barbara's book here: https://www.barbarafreese.com/industrialstrength-denial