Dr. Joanne Liu is a professor at the School of Population and Global Health at McGill University and a practicing physician at the University of Montreal. She is the former international president of Medicines Sans Frontiers/Doctors Without Borders and for the purposes of this conversation she served on the Independent Panel for Pandemic Preparedness and Response.  This panel was co-chaired former New Zealand Prime Minister Helen Clark and Former President of Liberia Ellen Johnson Sirleaf. It was formed by the World Health Organization in 2020 to provide an audit of how both the WHO and its member states were responding to COVID-19 and what steps need to be taken to prepare or prevent the next pandemic. As Dr. Joanne Liu explains, world leaders need to be approaching pandemic preparedness and response as if it were a potentially existential threat to humanity, on par with a nuclear catastrophe. This requires far greater levels of political attention than it currently receives.  We discuss at length why global cooperation around pandemic preparedness is lagging and what steps need to be taken in the near term to change course.