This episode is sponsored by Parsec for Teams - the only remote desktop fine tuned for games & game development. Securely connect to your studio PCs from anywhere, collaborate on projects in real-time, and test games with precise control. Sign up at parsecgaming.com/teams. Jamie Cheng chats with Robin Hunicke to discuss growing up in Hong Kong and moving to Canada to create games; founding Klei and releasing their first title; the ups and downs of being an independent developer; moving towards self publishing; retooling a game after premiering it to an audience; and designing difficult and deep gameplay experiences. Jamie is best known as the CEO of Klei Entertainment, makers of Don't Starve, Oxygen Not Included, Invisible Inc., Shank, Hot Lava, Mark of the Ninja, and Griftlands which is currently available in Early Access.  Are you a fan of the show? We need your help! Please take a moment to fill out this >>quick listener survey.