Before recently winning the NCAA women’s 500-yard freestyle swimming championship, Lia Thomas competed in the sport as a man. Should that matter? David French talks with Skye Jethani about the complexities of transgender rights, and why we need a more nuanced understanding of what “equal protection” means in the law. Then, French says the real divisions in our culture and politics aren’t primarily between Republicans and Democrats, or between conservatives and progressives, but between a traditional understanding of liberalism and the dangers of illiberalism. 0:00 - Intro 0:48 - Trans athletes “What Do We Do When People Are Equal, But Not Alike?” (David French article) - https://frenchpress.thedispatch.com/p/what-do-we-do-when-people-are-equal?s=r 34:28 - Liberalism and illiberalism 1:02:45 - EndHoly Post Patreon (now with book club!) - patreon.com/holypost