Session 99 If you're like most nontraditional premeds, you probably don't have a lot of time to shadow. If you can't build great relationships for LORs, what do you do? Check all our other podcasts on MedEd Media: The Premed Years Podcast, The MCAT Podcast, Specialty Stories, and our newest, Ask Dr. Gray: Premed Q&A. Special Announcement: OldPreMeds.org will soon send you to MedicalSchoolHQ.net. We still have the forums and expand them to allow traditional students to participate as well. Nonetheless, it's still going to be an awesome community of like-minded students who are there to collaborate, not compete. [02:38] OldPreMeds Question of the Week: "I'm a nontraditional premed student preparing to apply in the early summer for matriculation in Fall 2019. I've currently shadowed three physicians and have received letters of recommendation from them. However, these were friends that knew me for years and so we're practically prepared to write me a letter of recommendation before I ever stepped foot in their offices. They were also all MDs. For various reasons while I'm applying to allopathic schools, I have a much better chance at entering an osteopathic medical school. The DO schools I'm applying to, however, require at least one letter of recommendation from a DO. As a side note, I work full time for a shift to support my family so I'll only be able to work with a physician either a day or two using vacation time or outside of your typical 9-5 Monday through Friday schedule. My current job explicitly is not supportive of me leaving them and so will not work with me on this. All this to ask, when is it reasonable to ask a physician you never met until shadowing them for a letter of recommendation? I assume I'm correct that one or two days of shadowing them is insufficient. But then again, many people are not hired for jobs based on the impression they make on an interviewer in a one-hour conversation. Maybe this is similar. I simply don't want to make myself look stupid by asking far too early or unnecessarily use up valuable time that I could spend elsewhere. Any help is appreciated." [04:18] How Soon Is Too Soon to Ask for LORs? First, understand that a letter of recommendation is supposed to convey to the admissions committee who you are. And this position is putting their reputation on the line for you. So how long does it take for them to get to know you to write a strong letter of recommendation? This student has friends who are physicians. Those are going to be very strong letters of recommendation. And yes, it's okay to get a letter of recommendation from a friend. Also, it should explicitly say in that letter that they've known you for x number of years. For somebody you're shadowing for a couple of days or hours, it's going to be harder. But it's not out of the ordinary in this situation. Introduce yourself to the doctor and tell them you'd love to shadow them being an osteopathic physician. Tell them you want to apply to an osteopathic school and you need a letter of recommendation. Tell them that you need to shadow and that you want to make sure you understand what osteopathic medicine is all about. Ask if you could shadow them and that hopefully they could get to know you. Tell them you'd like to know osteopathic medicine. And ask if you could get a letter of recommendation from them if they're willing to. Then, ask how long does it normally take for them to write a strong letter of recommendation. Ask that question. Don't go in blindly. Ask the question and set up the expectation. A lot of students miss that part of the conversation. They tiptoe around at the very end of the very first day of shadowing and awkwardly ask for an LOR. Now the physician thinks you're making them do work. So set up that expectation from the beginning. This way they understand what questions they want to ask you during the day. They'd know what they need from you before you start shadowing or as you're shadowing. They may want your r