In this episode, Kate was joined by journalist and comedian, Ellie Gibson to discuss relationship struggles and how to make a marriage work in the wake of a separation. Ellie is the co-host of the number one parenting podcast The Scummy Mummies.  She joined forces with Helen Thorn to become The Scummy Mummies in 2013 and they have gone on to produce an award-winning podcast, a sell-out touring comedy show, and a popular book. The episode begins with Kate and Ellie exploring her relationship and how separation and space ended up making her marriage stronger, resulting in two beautiful children with her husband Pete. She describes the lead-up to her split from her now husband, Pete, which many will find relatable. A sequence of arguments about ‘small’ yet fundamental issues led to the couple deciding to take a series of breaks. Ellie found individual therapy useful in getting to a place where she could reconcile with her husband. She described the impact her best friend’s divorce had on her and her husband, and she talked about the importance of trying to navigate tough patches, rather than giving up or cheating. This episode is a homage to marriage and the work required to keep a relationship strong.