In this one-off special, Tom McTague interviews the conservative commentator, activist and former White House speechwriter David Frum — the man who coined George Bush’s famous “axis of evil.” Helen was away when David was in London. In the interview Tom and David discuss the war in Ukraine and lessons from Iraq, George Bush’s haunted retirement and the need for more “tragic thinking” when confronting the world’s problems.Twitter: @tommctague @HelenHet20 @TheseTimesPodPlease don't forget to subscribe and tell all your friends about These Times. If you have any feedback or questions for a future episode, email Tom and Helen at thesetimes@unherd.comThese Times, from UnHerd. The history of today’s politics with Tom McTague and Helen ThompsonEach week Tom and Helen explore the great forces and ideas that led us to where we are right now. It’s a politics podcast for those who want a deeper, historical understanding of the news, to understand what has really shaped our world and why. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.