Political analyst Ebrahim Fakir painted a dire picture on Eusebius on TimesLIVE about the true total cost of the leadership crisis within the governing African National Congress. With fellow political analyst and podcast host Eusebius McKaiser, Fakir explored the consequences of unethical leadership within the ANC going unpunished. Many examples, from the perjury conviction of former social development minister Bathabile Dlamini to murder-accused Mandla Msibi being elected as ANC Mpumalanga treasurer-general, suggest that unethical and even criminal conduct are not obstacles to occupying positions of leadership within the governing party. The nexus question of this edition of Eusebius on TimesLIVE is what the democratic consequences of these trends are, given that the ANC is a massive social movement within our society, and (for now, still) the largest political party by some distance.

Citing robust empirical data, Fakir argues that there has been a sharp decline in the levels of public trust in various democratic institutions, including a decline in the public's trust of political parties. This, in turn, is also matched by increased levels of stay away from, and non-participation in, elections. This, he argues, does not bode well for the continued legitimacy of the governing ANC. Mckaiser and Fakir both explored, furthermore, how the impunity of criminal and unethical leaders result in poor governance, and thereby opening up space for populist politics, including dangerous anti-foreigner sentiments from various opposition leaders and parties, all capitalising on the discontent of the proverbial masses.

These two interlocutors also debated whether the ANC's confidence is justified that the party, as a social movement, has deep roots within communities, roots that mitigate against the critical analysis of commentators. Using empirical data, however, Fakir explained why such a view is evidence-insensitive, and argued that the ANC, in the best case scenario, might