To start, a reflection on the week that was. Then, we return to our conversation with Stacey Abrams. She won her Gubernatorial primary this week in Georgia, where she hopes to unseat Brian Kemp this November.

We talk about the systemic challenges that small business owners face (6:32), the impact of Georgia’s new voting laws (11:20), the threat of election subversion (14:02), what a functional democracy could look like (16:48), the lessons learned from her 2018 bid for governor (19:31), and how she plans to win in 2022 (24:23). 

On the back half, Abrams reflects on growing up in the south (29:50), her earliest political ambitions (35:10), and how literature has offered a human complexity not always granted to people in politics (40:18), especially Black women in positions of power (42:17). As we leave, Stacey shares a personal story about her first visit to the governor’s mansion (46:05), the need to move past tribalism (50:42), and why she still wants to be in this fight in 2022 and beyond (52:55).

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