In episode 253 we welcome our guest, Carl Chang, founder and CEO of Kairos Investment Management. In today’s episode, we’re talking real estate. It’s not every day I get a chance to talk with a pizza entrepreneur, successful real-estate investment management firm CEO, or Federal Reserve Bank of San Francisco Board Member. Carl is all three. We get into Carl’s backstory and kicking off his career in the real estate business as a steward of family money. We discuss his firm’s investment criteria, looking at the fundamental core value of bricks and mortar, and evaluating opportunities by understanding whether or not they think they can make money in downside scenarios and earn durable cash flow. Carl reminds us that real estate is not all about yield, and walks us through what he was seeing in the early 2000s that made him a net seller during that period. We talk about what the real estate landscape looks like going forward, from opportunities on the debt side of real estate to multifamily housing. As we wind down, we discuss Carl’s role as a board member of the Federal Reserve Bank of San Francisco and what it’s been like to launch an innovative spin on pizza with Pieology. All this and more in episode 253 with Kairos’ Carl Chang.