Evan Spiegel, the co-founder and CEO of Snapchat maker Snap, talks with Recode’s Kara Swisher at the 2018 Code Conference. Spiegel talks about why Snapchat underwent a controversial redesign, why it partially reversed that decision and what he learned from the backlash. He also discusses how he’s evolving as a CEO since Snap’s IPO in 2017, having learned that leading a public company “requires a bit more grit.” He also addresses the departure of a female engineer who accused the company of having a toxic male-driven culture, calling her objections a “wake-up call.” Plus: How Spiegel thinks about “traditional social media,” i.e. Facebook, lifting features from the Snapchat app, and why it will be “harder” to copy those features in the future.