History is littered with terrible deeds and atrocities: conquest, genocide, mass enslavement, forced displacement, crimes of all sorts. Why do people agree to participate in these actions? Daniele Bolelli, host of the History on Fire podcast, joins me to discuss the topic and an essay I wrote on my Substack page, which you can find here: https://patrickwyman.substack.com/p/ordinary-people-do-terrible-thingsPatrick's book is now available! Get The Verge: Reformation, Renaissance, and Forty Years that Shook the World in hardcopy, ebook, or audiobook (read by Patrick) here: https://bit.ly/PWverge. And check out Patrick's new podcast The Pursuit of Dadliness! It’s all about “Dad Culture,” and Patrick will interview some fascinating guests about everything from tall wooden ships to smoked meats to comfortable sneakers to history, sports, culture, and politics. https://bit.ly/PWtPoDListen to new episodes 1 week early, to exclusive seasons 1 and 2, and to all episodes ad free with Wondery+. Join Wondery+ for exclusives, binges, early access, and ad free listening. Available in the Wondery App https://wondery.app.link/tidesofhistorySee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.