First ladies are among the most powerful advisers in any White House and
Jill Biden is no exception. On this episode of Deep Dive, host and
Playbook co-author Ryan Lizza is joined by NYT White House correspondent
Katie Rogers, who recently published  “American Woman: The
Transformation of the Modern First Lady, from Hillary Clinton to Jill
Biden,” an authoritative account of how this century’s first ladies have
influenced the nation. 

Ryan and Katie discuss Jill Biden and Melania Trump’s roles in staffing,
campaigning, and policy decisions; sensitive items from their times in
the White House, such as Melania and Donald’s prenup; and whether or not
Jill Biden has ever forgiven Kamala Harris for what she said about Joe
in 2020. Additionally, Katie opened up about the time her editors at the
New York Times sent her to Arkansas and forced her to report a story
about the Bidens that she didn’t want to cover — and how it ended up
forcing Jill and Joe to confront an uncomfortable truth about their
family.

Ryan Lizza is a Playbook co-author for POLITICO.
Katie Rogers is a White House correspondent for The New York Times. 
Kara Tabor is a producer for POLITICO audio. 
Alex Keeney is a senior producer for POLITICO audio.