This week starts off with Allie Marotta & Kathryn Yu comparing notes on their experiences with Bottom of the Ocean, diving deep into explaining the secrets they were asked to tell sea shells (trying saying THAT five times fast!)Then Blake Weil & Patrick McLean do an even deeper dive into the book Turn Your Life Into Art: Lessons in Psychomagic from the San Francisco Underground [19:00], opening up a conversation on the importance of safety over danger in designed experiences. Get bonus content on Patreon Our GDPR privacy policy was updated on August 8, 2022. Visit acast.com/privacy for more information.