"We sometimes forget that the knowledge systems we use to conceptualize the world are not necessarily exactly the same thing as the world that we're conceptualizing. We mistake the model of the model for the thing that is being modeled. We mistake the map for the territory. We mistake the word for the thing." In this episode, we welcome Catriona Sandilands, a professor of environmental arts and justice at the Faculty of Environmental and Urban Change, York University. Having written, edited, or co-edited four books and close to 100 essays and articles, her research areas include queer and feminist posthumanities, critical plant studies, biocultural histories, ecocriticism, and public environmental engagement through literature and storytelling. Some of the topics we explore in this conversation include cultivating plurality within the stories we tell, remembering histories of reciprocity coming from Western traditions, the connection between how we relate to the more-than-human world and our views of and experiences with sexuality, and more.   (The musical offering featured in this episode is Everyday Magic by Luna Bec. The episode-inspired artwork is by Ellie Yanagisawa.) Support our in(ter)dependent show: GreenDreamer.com/support