With Courtney in China for a bit, Ben was delighted to meet up in D.C. with The Washington Post's Liz Clarke, who recently returned from Chicago where she covered the second Laver Cup, the novel new event which seems to defy expectations and definitions in tennis in first two successful editions.

Ben and Liz discuss her impressions of the event and how players and crowds have taken to it, what makes it work, the definition of "exhibition," and her take on the competing interests in men's tennis now.

Liz also shares her experience and wisdom on what makes tennis' struggles so uniquely frustrating and self-sabotaging (and please do go buy her great book on NASCAR if that bit piques your interest whatsoever).

And, of course, The Boss plays her out. 

As always, thanks for liking us on Facebook (leave comments on the episode thread! Engage with other listeners!), following us on Twitter (discuss this episode with hashtag #NCR215!), and subscribing/reviewing on iTunes on iTunes or whatever your podcasting app/platform of choice may be!