On this interview episode, Andy, Gene, and Derek talk with Zak Sally, the creator behind Like a Dog,  Recidivist, and Sammy the Mouse…a narrative that Derek calls “the Waiting for Godot of comics.” His second installment in the planned four-book Sammy the Mouse series just recently came out from Uncivilized Books, and the guys discuss with Zak the genesis of that project and his strategies for plotting the story. Zak also talks about his beginnings with zines in the 1990s;  music and his time with the band, Low; his efforts with La Mano, his own publishing arm (pun intended); his work on the upcoming fourth issue of Recidivist; the artistic limitations of Tumblr; and his experiences in Duluth and Minneapolis. Along the way, the conversation (de)evolves into a discussion of Battle of the Network Stars, Telly Savalas commercials for Duluth, and how the name “Dylan” is actually pronounced in Hibbing, Minnesota.